Darryl Keil Last Activity 2025-09-09 11:09 AM
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Greg Shapland

Posts: 16

Joined: 2005-04-05
Location: Bellevue, NE

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Subject : What glue to use
Posted : 2007-09-26 8:49 PM
Post #34069
I came across an artisan who veneers onto Fuel tanks etc, for motorcycles. I am going to try to do my own bike. I think I have the process figured out but I'm not 100% sure. I'm going to do a spare tank first. Step 1) Sand blast all existing finish down to bare metal. 2) Hand cut to fit and tape up veneer. 3) Create a cap/ plug with a hose to the outside of vac bag. 4) Glue up and press. 5) cross fingers. 6) finish with automotive clear coat.

I'm thinking I will use Epoxy but not sure which type and/ or brand?
I haven't used Epoxy to do veneer before. I am planning to shield with poly, and use evacu net with no caul.

Any advice will be appreciated




 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: What glue to use
Posted : 2007-09-27 8:38 PM
Post #34071 - In reply to #34069
I seem to remember someone typing they had used System 3 products for veneering with some success. I can't recall ever using epoxy myself for veneer. I have heard of using polyurethane glue to apply veneer to aluminum after scuff sanding the aluminum well. I'd suggest some tests, as there may be fuel, oil, and paint residues on used tanks.

I'd also suggest extensive testing to see how to cut the veneer to shape the result to the tank, how to draw an even vacuum pressure against the veneer, and how long it would take to apply the glue and veneer, get in the bag, and get the full vacuum. I was surprised at how long it took to prepare the assembly and draw the vacuum when veneering just one side of a truncated pyramid, and that was a flat surface.


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: What glue to use
Posted : 2007-09-28 3:11 PM
Post #34072 - In reply to #34069
I've used epoxy as a veneer adhesive, and it's very effective (as an adhesive, however it bleeds bad). This may be your best bet in this application, or maybe a poly glue, but I don't use poly glues for veneering, so I can't really comment on it.

My experience with epoxy is not always pleasant, though. It bleeds through pretty bad. West System sells an additive to thicken it, but I've never tried it.

Also, my epoxy recommendation is West System. It's been the backbone of the boatbuilding trade for a while. It's all I use when I reach for epoxy.

You may want to try my following method, which may sound crazy, but it worked.

I used so much West System, that I wanted to make sure that it would bleed through thoroughly and saturate the veneer. As a matter of fact, after applying the veneer with adhesive, I brushed epoxy ONTO the veneer after it was laid down, before going into the vacuum bag.

This method made the epoxy not only an adhesive, but also a finish of sorts.

If the bleed through is going to be so bad with epoxy, then I just decided to go with it, and let it bleed completely throughout the project.

It worked, but I've only done this once.

Also, think about this...as far as outdoor finishes go, it's either epoxy or spar varnish, my opinion. If you thoroughly saturate this with epoxy, it will already be set with an outdoor finish...maybe some more application after the pressing, though.

Please let us know how it goes...I'd like to learn which method works for you.


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: What glue to use
Posted : 2007-09-28 9:42 PM
Post #34073 - In reply to #34072
I just thought of something...

How will you put a fuel tank into a vacuum bag without the tank being crushed?

You could have an internal bag, but I think that this will get pretty complicated....but then again, I really only do flat work and some mild curves here and there...


 
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Marty Schlosser

Posts: 2

Joined: 2007-05-31
Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada

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Subject : RE: What glue to use
Posted : 2007-11-04 7:30 AM
Post #34167 - In reply to #34073
I was thinking that perhaps the best approach would be that which is used by boat builders and not use a bag at all. They simply lay down the veneer with glue, place a plastic sheet over the area being laminated, seal the edges with mastic, cut a slit in the plastic and insert the hose.

The above method is described in a pamphlet I got from WEST Epoxy a few years back, so it may be shown on their website.

What does everyone think?


 
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Link Van Cleave

Posts: 8

Joined: 2007-10-16

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Subject : Epoxy as finish
Posted : 2007-11-08 8:27 PM
Post #34181 - In reply to #34072
Brian,
Epoxy by itself is not a "outdoor finish". It has no UV resistance. It needs to be coated with paint or a uv spar varnish or something simular. It is however a great moisture barrier if protected from sunlight.
Link


 
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Don Papenburg

Posts: 1

Joined: 2007-11-25
Location: Streator Illinois

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Subject : RE: Epoxy as finish
Posted : 2007-11-25 6:13 PM
Post #34208 - In reply to #34181
To keep the tank from crushing plug the outlets with pipe plug fill with water all the way to the top of the filler neck put a good sealing cap on the tank . The water will not let the tank deform.


 
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Greg Shapland

Posts: 16

Joined: 2005-04-05
Location: Bellevue, NE

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Subject : What glue to use
Posted : 2007-11-28 6:55 PM
Post #34209 - In reply to #34208
After re reading my post it seems I wasn't clear on step 3) The cap and hose to the outside of the bag will allow the tank to fill with air in the same mannor as using an air form/ bladder inside of the bag. this will keep the tank from crushing.
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