Darryl Keil Last Activity 2025-02-12 2:48 PM
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mike mcnerney

Posts: 87

Joined: 2003-07-17
Location: ottawa ontario

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Subject : substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 6:35 AM
Post #36133

I reviewed some previous post to see what folks like for substrates & why.
But, I am bringing it up again because of the job I am doing. I am probably going to use mdf for the 30" x 48" table. The legs will be attatched with screws from underneath.
We do have a new product in my area that is similar to lumber core. They made a sheet of 5/8" ply, ripped it up into 1" wide pieces, glued it back together & put a sheet of of veneer on top & bottom, to end up with 3/4". It seems to be pretty flat. Has anyone used it?
thanks
Mike McNerney


 
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ckurak

Posts: 107

Joined: 2006-10-28
Location: Florida

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 9:54 AM
Post #36134 - In reply to #36133

Mike,

I use MDF for my cores. It is flat. AND, it does not telegraph like plywood has in the past for me.

Let me explain. I used 3/4" plywood for a project (8 foot long counter) that look and felt perfectly flat. However, after pressing Birds Eye Maple veneer on the counter in a vacuum press, it was no longer smooth. I proceeded with finishing anyway, and it simply magnified the issue. Fortunately I was able to resolve the issue with very careful sanding that removed the ridges without any sand-through. (I used the presence of the finishing color to guide me through the process. If I still had some color, that area still needed sanding.) However, I was ready and willing to start building a new counter from scratch. I got lucky, once. I will never do that again.

The downside of MDF is that it does not hold screws very well. I usually build small pieces or counters. Small pieces get a frame of some type. Counters stay in place pretty much by themselves due to weight and their position up against a wall (or in a niche). A couple of screws will hold them in place for my application.

Now, screws in a table top? Someone else needs to answer that one, as I cannot.

Good luck!

Charles


 
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Enrico Konig

Posts: 74

Joined: 2006-01-06
Location: Vancouver, BC

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 11:01 AM
Post #36135 - In reply to #36134

I myself have grown a bit suspicious of mdf, due to the fact that twice now I have had delamination issues, where the veneer was able to pull off the outer layer of the mdf. No problem with the urea resin glue line between the veneer and mdf -- the problem was with the mdf itself. Yes, this may have been bad batches of mdf that weren't made with enough resin. In my telephone conversations with Darryl over these failures, he advised to start using furniture-grade particle board. He also advised me to skim coat the veneer surface with epoxy, to lock in the veneer from the top. I am now doing the skim coat with everything.
The other issue with you Mike is wanting to screw legs into mdf -- not good. Definitely weak on the screw-holding power. Especially for something with leverage such as a leg. If you are still comfortable using mdf, as it does have certain advantages (when it holds together), I would advise making up your own lamination using a good quality plywood as the core, with 1/8" or 1/4" mdf on each side. That way you get the mdf to veneer on, with the actual plywood to screw into. I have done this numerous times in the past.


 
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mike mcnerney

Posts: 87

Joined: 2003-07-17
Location: ottawa ontario

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 4:45 PM
Post #36136 - In reply to #36135

When you talk about your own lamination, do you mean like .5" BB with .25" mdf on both sides? Would .125 mdf be just as good?
I am going to have a built up edge of 1 to 1.25 thick so I was thinking of adding some .5 BB to the underside & attatch a .125 metal plate to the leg & then screw the metal to the BB & mdf approx 1".
Mike


 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 6:57 PM
Post #36137 - In reply to #36136

Mike:
Hate to rain on your parade, but I wouldn't be comfortable attaching naked legs to solid wood top using metal plate and screws. There's no way to run an apron between the legs? How long does this have to last, and will it be treated with kid gloves?


 
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Darryl Keil

Posts: 1454

Joined: 2003-05-22
Location: Maine

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-09 8:08 PM
Post #36140 - In reply to #36136

Mike,

Whats the name of this re-ripped plywood with the 1/16" skin on both sides? Sounds interesting.

Darryl Keil


 
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craig tufankjian

Posts: 308

Joined: 2004-02-01
Location: syracuse ny 13208

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Subject : RE: substrates
Posted : 2010-08-10 8:45 AM
Post #36141 - In reply to #36140

MRF might be a better choice for a table top. Also a light scuffing with 80 grit will give the glue more bite. A toothing blade in a scraper is also a great way to give the surface more glue area to adhere to.

Regardless of the tables shape you might consider a dummy plate method of construction.


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