Darryl Keil Last Activity 2026-01-12 8:29 AM
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Gregg

Posts: 12

Joined: 2006-03-03
Location: chicago

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Subject : Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-10-26 8:37 AM
Post #35746
I am building some mirrors for an upcoming show. In order to save time, I would like to veneer the face & back over oak & maple hardwood and leave the sides solid hardwood rather than building with mdf so I don't have to edgeband. The sides/stiles are about 2" and the veneer direction will match the hardwood, but the top rail of the frame which is about 7" tall where the veneer will be cross grained. I calculated wood movement tangentially to be .05" over the 7" width with a 4% change in humidity.

Should I stick with mdf due to 1/16" wood movement, or will 1/16" not affect the veneer?

Should I 2 ply?




 
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Darryl Keil

Posts: 1456

Joined: 2003-05-22
Location: Maine

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-10-26 3:33 PM
Post #35747 - In reply to #35746
Gregg,

As long as you cross band with a backer veneer under the face veneer you should be reasonably OK. The big issue is going over the joint where the stiles meet the rail. I would make sure you use a rigid glue on the solid wood joints rather than a white or yellow glue so you don't have glue creep at these joints telegraphing into the veneer.

Darryl Keil


 
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Enrico Konig

Posts: 74

Joined: 2006-01-06
Location: Vancouver, BC

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-12-11 12:25 PM
Post #35800 - In reply to #35747
I have a similar conundrum right now. I have a 41" x 80" elliptical tabletop that is a honeycomb panel covered on both sides with 2-ply french walnut. Included in those overall dimensions is the 2 1/4" wide solid black walnut edging. Table thickness is 1 3/4". Clients are unhappy now with their wood choice (they went against my advice)and are willing to pay for me to remake it, however reluctantly. I'm wondering if I can save them a bunch of money by saving all the complicated honeycomb work and simply reveneer this, going right over the solid wood edge. I understand I'd need to two-ply, but I'm still worried about that hardwood/veneer joint telegraphing through over time. And the wood edge was glued on with pva as well. Would perhaps 3-ply work if 2-ply didn't, or does the tabletop just need to be redone?

Any advice anyone?

Enrico Konig


 
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craig tufankjian

Posts: 308

Joined: 2004-02-01
Location: syracuse ny 13208

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-12-11 7:07 PM
Post #35801 - In reply to #35800
Enrico,

Do you have access to a wide belt sander? if so throw a 60 grit and abrasive plane until you get past the glue. then go to 80 to smooth the surface.

if not triple ply should be fine if your customers can stand the extra thickness. that's triple ply both side of course.


 
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Enrico Konig

Posts: 74

Joined: 2006-01-06
Location: Vancouver, BC

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-12-11 7:43 PM
Post #35802 - In reply to #35801
Thanks very much for answering Craig, but I'm not sure I understand. I do have access to a wide belt sander. And I was thinking to bring the top over there and give it a sand to ensure that the solid wood edging is perfectly flat with veneered torsion box, as that solid wood edging was all originally levelled flush to veneered surface with hand planes. In other words, I was thinking of a wide-belt sand just to true the surface. You're saying to sand off previous 2-plies back down to mdf skins? This still leaves the 2 1/4" wide solid wood edge intact, and I'm worried about that joint telegraphing through even 2 ply if I reveneer right over top of it. Especially since that 2 1/4" wide edge was glued on using PVA glue.

So I'm thinking maybe 3-ply will ease those concerns about that joint telegraphing through over time. On the other hand, I've never laid up 3-ply. Done the same as 2-ply, except the one extra layer cross-banded? Seems like it could be tricky spreading glue on 2 veneer layers without things curling up out of control and then laying on the show face ...

thanks
Enrico


 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-12-11 7:43 PM
Post #35803 - In reply to #35800
Just curious about the table itself. Did you add the 2.25" wide edging after veneering the honeycomb? And is the edging molded or square edge? If you double or triple ply, would the walnut edging still show, or is that to be covered in veneer also? If the former, a triple ply and to some extent even a double ply might be a noticeable line over and under the hardwood edging.


 
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Enrico Konig

Posts: 74

Joined: 2006-01-06
Location: Vancouver, BC

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Subject : RE: Veneering over solid hardwood.
Posted : 2009-12-11 8:04 PM
Post #35804 - In reply to #35803
Yes, there is that consideration as well. Although I find 2-ply lines at the edge, given the ridiculous thinness of commercial veneers, quite subtle. At least once they're eased. Clearly a triple ply edge won't be as subtle. I was going to leave the solid wood edging showing, as the original idea of a 2.25" wide wood edge was to have something a little more robust than a veneered edge. Especially now since that edge is already applied.
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