Darryl Keil Last Activity 2025-09-09 11:09 AM
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Bob Edenhofer

Posts: 2

Joined: 2010-02-19
Location: Ocklawaha, Fla

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Subject : Torsion box
Posted : 2010-02-20 9:03 AM
Post #35933

I recently volunteered to buid an altar for our new church, and the design they want is pedestal style. I need a heavy base with a very light top. The base will consist of four laminated layers of 3/4" MDF which will be wrapped with a solid hardwood cove, and veneered. My first question is, should the bottom of the base (3" thick)also be veneered? The top will be 4" thick, 8' long, 3'wide in the center, curving to 30" on the ends. The top would be built torsion box style, with 1/4" MDF skins over bass wood ribs. My questions here are;
1) How thick should the ribs be?
2) What should the spacing be?
3) When the top is built, can plywood be fastened to the ribs where I need to attach the pedestal?
4) When veneering, should I add a cross grain layer?
5)Would I be better off using a honeycomb between the MDF?
This type of construction is new to me, so I would appreciate any help I can get to ensure a piece that will last.


 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: Torsion box
Posted : 2010-02-20 7:03 PM
Post #35934 - In reply to #35933

Bob:
I hope lots of people will contribute their thoughts.
When I build a pedestal table, I like to outline of the base to be within ten inches of the outline of the top, so if your top is 8' long and 3' wide, the base would be at least 6'4" long and at least 16" wide. This width seems too narrow, so I'd be more comfortable with a base width of 24". A base 3" thick MDF will be heavy, but I'd still not be comfortable with a smaller base.
Veneering both sides of a surface is recommended because drying adhesive adds stress. However, four layers of 3/4" MDF will be able to resist such stress - I don't think it's necessary to veneer the bottom of the base.
I think I'd first make the curved sides of the top, gluing several layers of 1/4" or 1/8" plywood with a rigid adhesive such as epoxy or urea formaldelyde over a bending form. A cabinet shop supplier will have 10' sheets of MDF. They are very heavy, but you can rip strips and with a pattern router bit make a form.
The cleanest appearance, for joining the base and pedestal to the top, would be to imbed a piece of 3/4" plywood in the torsion box. The easiest way to do this would be to use 3/4" paper honeycomb around the plywood. If you have a sub-top capping your column, you could screw from the underside of the sub-top into the imbedded 3/4" plywood.
In small quantities, resin coated paper honeycomb is only available in 1/2, 3/4, and 1" thicknesses, so you'd have to build up the total thickness in several layers. My understanding of torsion boxes is that the rigidity is strongly related to the total gluing surface. If you use basswood strips 3 1/2" tall with 1/4" skins, you'll only have two gluing surfaces, and I don't know if that would be rigid enough for your use. But it's a big project for a full sized test panel . . .
Don Stephan


 
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Bob Edenhofer

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Joined: 2010-02-19
Location: Ocklawaha, Fla

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Subject : RE: Torsion box
Posted : 2010-02-21 7:24 PM
Post #35935 - In reply to #35934

Hi Don,
Thank you for getting back to me, I do appreciate it. With my altar project, I have the base laminated,(although not veneered), which is approximately 26"x48". I took the pedestal, which is an extended octogon with an open back, measuring 21 1/2" deep by 25" wide and clamped it to the base, and then clamped a 2x4x8'to the top, and was able to put all my weight (200lbs)on the end, and it did not tip.
When I Make the grid, how thick should the basswood be, and what spacing would you reccommend? Also, I will have a subtop mounted to the pedestal to mount the top on.


 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: Torsion box
Posted : 2010-02-22 8:01 PM
Post #35939 - In reply to #35935

There was an article or two in Fine Woodworking several years ago describing torion boxes with wood lattice core, you might see if you can locate same. I don't have a feel for width and spacing of the lattice.
I've seen a suggestion that one of the woodworking compendiums (formulas, et cetera) had a chapter on torsion boxes, but I've never found such in woodworking stores. Perhaps you could search on Amazon books?


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