Darryl Keil Last Activity 2025-09-09 11:09 AM
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Scott

Posts: 31

Joined: 2006-08-23
Location: New Hampshire

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Subject : Thickner added to Unibond 800
Posted : 2007-02-13 10:44 AM
Post #33595

I find unibond very usefull in glueing up complicated assemblys that require a lot of time to get everything coated and under clamps. In this type of assembly PVA glues set up way too fast and have no gap filling abilitys. Epoxys are way too messy , dont clean up easily and take way too long to set to a ridgid glue line . I have found unibond 800 perfect because it sets in 4 hours, has a long open time, cleans up off the case with water. Also I am able to make it fill gaps nicely by adding a thickener that I use for epoxy called cabosil. It turns the glue from a runny mess (when using it on joinery) to a nice thick gap filling mixture that doesnt run out of the joints. My question is this. Am I compromising the integrity of the glue by adding cabosil? Darryl do you condone this practise? So far it has worked great for me and I have not had a short term problem at all. It sets hard as a rock and fills all the gaps too. Scott


 
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Darryl Keil

Posts: 1455

Joined: 2003-05-22
Location: Maine

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Subject : RE: Thickner added to Unibond 800
Posted : 2007-02-13 11:14 PM
Post #33597 - In reply to #33595

Scott,

I understand your reason for adding thickener meant for epoxy to Unibond 800 and up to a point its probably OK. We dont really have the time to thoroughly test possible additive variations to Unibond 800. Before I would put our official stamp of approval to something like what you are doing we would do some pretty exhaustive testing first. An unofficial answer would be, a little bit would probably be acceptable. How much could you add before the glue line begins to be compromised, 1, 2, 5, 10 percent? I cant really say.

Although both Unibond 800 and epoxy are true catalytic glue which achieve their final cure by chemical reaction, there is a important difference between the two. Epoxy is what I call a structural bond, meaning you could literally float two pieces of wood in a bed of epoxy and get a good bond. Not so with Unibond 800. Unibond 800 requires good intimate contact between both surfaces being glued and does not have the level of gap filling ability that epoxy does. This is why epoxy can handle the quantity of thickener that Unibond 800 cant. With that said Unibond 800 does have some gap filling ability up to a point.

So in conclusion I just recommend you do some simple testing. If your tests give you positive results then I would say your fine to go forward as long as you dont exceed the percentage of thickener you tested for.

Sincerely
Darryl Keil


 
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Scott

Posts: 31

Joined: 2006-08-23
Location: New Hampshire

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Subject : RE: Thickner added to Unibond 800
Posted : 2007-02-15 11:36 AM
Post #33601 - In reply to #33597

Thanks Darryl, That was an excellent answer and I will take your advice. So far I have only used this method to assemble drawers that are all dovetailed with the drawer faces being made of MDF. The faces are curved and made up of 3 1/4" layers of 1/4" MDF on a form in the bag. The faces are for Federal furniture and have a lot of highly figured veneer, geometrical motifs, handmade inlays and crossbands. I have cracking and checking problems if I use anything besides MDF as a core material. The problem is when I go to dovetail the half blind drawers faces with the very narrow delicate pins that are traditional to a federal piece. Its like cutting a dovetail pin in cardboard. I find the end result needs to be a little loose so The pins dont crack when trying to fit a tight joint. The edges of the drawer face are of course **** beaded. Thanks again.
scott


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