Darryl Keil Last Activity 2025-09-09 11:09 AM
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Roger Muller

Posts: 4

Joined: 2005-04-29
Location: Carmel, IN

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Subject : Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-08 9:45 AM
Post #34176
Has anyone had experience using this system for stacking and trimming edges of veneer prior to taping?


 
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Jeff Patrick


Joined: 2004-04-15
Location: Bainbridge Island, WA

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-08 3:38 PM
Post #34178 - In reply to #34176
I recently acquired the Festool 55 saw and guide bars. Having used it on only one veneer species, my experience is limited. I must say, however, on figured english sycamore it did a great job. I rip cut through a stack of as many as six pieces of veneer and it was ready for tape-up. No chip out was noticed. I cross cut glued panels with no chip out.... I was impressed.

My past method of jointing flitch veneer was to use my router with a very straight piece of mdf as a guide. The Festool is much faster and gives top notch results.... as good or better than the router. The "sticky" guide bar does as advertised. I did clamp it for cuts that simply had no room for error or slipage, but for other cuts I simply let the sticky pads do the work. It has never slipped.

I was a healthy skeptic of the saw and guide. I'm not ready to marry the thing, but it has earned my respect.

Jeff


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-08 7:22 PM
Post #34179 - In reply to #34178
If you do a search for "Festool" in this forum you'll find some info...

Here's a decent thread.

http://www.vacupress.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=16468&MessageID=32982#32982

Bottom line, I saw Paul Schurch use the Festool to trim veneer, and I've used it ever since...never been disappointed.

Flawless jointed edges in even the squirreliest grain.

(is squirreliest a word?)

Bottom line, I use the Festool to cut veneer all the time. NEVER had an issue.

That being said, some people here use a Fein Mutimaster setup. I've never used the Fein setup, so I can't comment on it.

Seems like it would be cheaper to go this way, but you also have to build the jig.

On the other hand, the Festool will do a lot more than just cut veneer.

I use mine with this setup for a multitude of operatations...

http://www.briangray.net/projectdetail.cfm?ProjectID=32


 
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Frank Seidel

Posts: 13

Joined: 2006-12-15
Location: Saxony, Germany

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-11 1:02 PM
Post #34186 - In reply to #34176
I can only agree with the two previous opinions. I´m using the Festool Guide rail together with the 55mm circular saw for cutting all kinds of veneer several pieces at one time usually without clamps. I therefore place the bundle on top of a piece of 6mm Plywood and set the depth so that it cuts about 2mm in to the plywood.A 10´x50´sheet will be good for a couple of projects and you can use both sides. For delicate veneer backward cutting i.e. moving the saw in the wrong direction will improve your results.
Im sure that Darryls router guide works great, however for the few sporadic veneer jobs I´ve done I stuck with this very simple method.
Another advantage of the Guide Rail is that it can produce very long straight cuts when sometimes the router guide might be too short.



 
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Darryl Keil

Posts: 1455

Joined: 2003-05-22
Location: Maine

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-12 8:40 PM
Post #34188 - In reply to #34186
I'm always interested in passing along new ways of cutting veneer. What are folks using for a saw blade with this method?

Darryl


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 9:54 AM
Post #34189 - In reply to #34188
The standard Festool blade (28 teeth) works fine, but I've always used the fine tooth (48 teeth), just in case. Probably a little cleaner cut.


 
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Jeff Patrick


Joined: 2004-04-15
Location: Bainbridge Island, WA

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 12:36 PM
Post #34190 - In reply to #34188
Darryl,My saw, the TS 55, came with a 48 tooth ATB blade. This is the only one I've used. It cuts are splendid. No chip out on the upper surface when using the guide bar. There is also very little chip out at the exit edge on a cross-cut board but I guard against this anyway by scoring or taping. This blade will rip lumber and leave it very smooth, but not fast. I was a true skeptic regarding this saw until I tried it on a real job. I'd encourage anybody who does this kind of work for a living to seriously consider acquiring one of these. And this is a recommendation from one who is absolutely not a tool junky. Don't get me wrong, I've got plenty of tools and buy whatever I need, but tool catalogs and "what's new" just don't thrill me. The Festool saw is a big help, so that's why I'm liking it. My local dealer must believe also, they offer a 30 day full return if you don't like the saw.... no questions asked. Other stores may do likewise...... maybe it's a Festool policy. Jeff


 
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Scott

Posts: 31

Joined: 2006-08-23
Location: New Hampshire

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 1:06 PM
Post #34191 - In reply to #34190
Im just curious, what makes a circular saw not chip or blow out very fine veneers at just 1/40th of an inch thick. It seems hard to believe. Is it the guide that holds the veneer tight with very little clearance? But even still 40 teeth you would think would still blow it apart. Wouldnt this be similar to running a sheet of veneer through a table saw? I have tried that with brittle veneers and the table saw just blows them apart even with a zero clearance insert due to teeth of the blade. What makes this festool work so well and will it cut mahogany crotch? I have always used a straight edge and a sharp veneer saw. Thanks for any info.
Scott


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 2:49 PM
Post #34192 - In reply to #34191
The Festool guide has a rubber "mat" that just barely protrudes past the aluminum.

The first time that you use the guide, you run the saw, and trim the rubber mat to a perfect zero clearance.

So the fragile veneer is tightly sandwiched between this rubber mat, and your work table.

Zero clearance, held tight, perfect cuts.


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 2:51 PM
Post #34193 - In reply to #34192
Honestly, all I can say is try it.

It'll blow your mind. I had to see it to believe it.


 
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Scott

Posts: 31

Joined: 2006-08-23
Location: New Hampshire

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 3:11 PM
Post #34194 - In reply to #34193
Thanks Brian, If it works that well then it is just the tool I have been looking for. Appreciate the explanation. It makes a lot more sence now.
Scott


 
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Jeff Patrick


Joined: 2004-04-15
Location: Bainbridge Island, WA

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 5:31 PM
Post #34195 - In reply to #34194
Scott,

There is also a little plastic gizzy that acts as a hold-down on the waste side of the cut. I don't always use this, but I think it helps keep the waste veneer from vibrating and that helps keep it all intact.

I'm not gonna be one of those Festool maniacs but it is a very well made and well thought out machine. I used it recently to 45º miter the top and sides of a large cabinet (top was 2'x8'). I got perfect cuts that closed without a hitch. That impressed me.

Jeff


 
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Don Stephan

Posts: 825

Joined: 2003-07-18
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-13 7:46 PM
Post #34196 - In reply to #34194
For the first several projects, I used a homemade jig with a small PC router, as demonstrated in one of Darryl Keil's videos. On about 1/3 of the "trims" there was enough roughness that the router had to be used for a second pass.

I purchased the Festool saw and guide because Paul Schurch demonstrated a perfect trim in about half the time needed for the router method. Since then I have been extremely happy with it. On some straight grain maple, after trimming I first pulled the glue side of the joints together with blue masking tape. When I flipped the assembly over to apply veneer tape to the show side, I quite literally couldn't find three of the four seams.

When I used the Festool saw and guide to trim some wenge, there was some chipout on I think two of the four trims. I would think wenge is one of the veneers most prone to chipping, and on the second pass each time the results were perfect.

I've only been using the standard blade that came with the saw, and cutting on the forward pass. I've heard that even better results can be obtained by pulling the Festool saw backwards rather than pushing it forwards, but I've not had to try that.

I'd never buy the Festool for rough framing, but it works exactly as advertised, and for important cuts should last me the ten to fifteen years to retirement.


 
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Darryl Keil

Posts: 1455

Joined: 2003-05-22
Location: Maine

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-14 8:12 AM
Post #34197 - In reply to #34196
To all you Festool owners,

Would it work well for cutting a stack of 12 pieces at once for a 12 way radial match? Has anyone tried this?

Darryl


 
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Brian Gray

Posts: 339

Joined: 2004-01-21
Location: Sandusky, OH

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Subject : RE: Festool Bar Plus Saw or Router for Trimming Veneer
Posted : 2007-11-14 9:32 AM
Post #34198 - In reply to #34197
I've done this, Darryl, but it's tricky.

The problem is that the veneer tape on the edges made the stack thicker on one side, and not the other, which will make the Festool guide sit at a slight angle, and not cut a perfect right angle.

I pulled it off, but I feel better doing a 12 way (or more) match one piece at a time.
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